Space Engineers Feedback

31
Votes
SPEED SPEED SPEED!
take the speed limit off already goddammit, there are so many mods you could use the coding from to do this, and i doubt they would mind, and even if you wont remove it, at the very least youneed to raise it because very few people anymore play with the vanilla speed limit, at least that i know of


admiralpeck shared this idea 30/08/17 02:36
baratgab 30/08/17 15:00
I don't have any more votes left, but I definitely agree. The default speed limit, since it's very low, has a constant in-your-face feeling whenever you fly anything...
Krienas 30/08/17 15:01
I believe _removal_ of speed limits will be the last thing keen will consider (if ever) after they are done with performance and optimizations efforts. Speed limits are there for reason. It was easy way to help average players to have more stable experience . The faster you move, the more stuff needs to be loaded and there are limits what game can pull off. When you go over that limit all sorts of problems starts - clangs, desyncs, etc. By removing that limit you call yourself for problems when you reach speed your calculator, network or server can't handle :) What Keen could consider though - increasing speed limits when overall game performance increases enough. I personally would love to get it increased to the point of orbital speeds.
posthy 30/08/17 18:31
It's not just about the need to load more stuff, but also collision detection. If you remove the speed limit and move fast enough you can fly straight through a planet without the game realizing you should have been crashed. The engine isn't capable of handling high speeds. Hopefully with more optimisations they'll be able to raise the limit, It's pretty low, I agree.
baratgab 30/08/17 19:49
SE is not the only game that (would) have to deal with high speed collisions. The issue of gameobjects moving too much frame-by-frame and thereby missing collision detection is a relatively common issue, and I've read some solutions on gamedev.stackexchange, e.g. swept volumes. If Keen don't want to solve it, because they think it's not important, they should simply say that. :P
Krienas 30/08/17 19:54
@baratgab can you give me an example of game where it is solved without actually switching to different flight mode? I am trying, but have difficulties to come up with one..
baratgab 30/08/17 20:25
@Krienas, I don't have any game names, as I encountered this topic while I was learning (Unity3D) game development, so what I saw were just pure technical solutions, which are supposed to work. For example this: https://gamedev.stackexchange.com/questions/62360/small-high-speed-object-collisions-avoiding-tunneling
baratgab 30/08/17 20:27
(I'd be really curious to hear why something like this [what I linked above] could not work for SE.)
sirhamsteralot 30/08/17 21:57
oh it could work, havok supports it. its just bad for performance but maybe they can reconsider it after optimizing stuff :p
Darkaiser 31/08/17 13:12
As an option, have the max speed be on a slider just like the rest of the controls with the current speed being the default. If a player only plays solo or with a small group and they all have secure connections, they could increase the top speed in small increments until they start having issues. That way, if the player wants to take the heat for it, they can dial it to 11.
KManALPHA 18/09/17 20:17
If they don't increase the max speed before finishing dev, and they save it for the end, we may see some serious issues. I suggest they up the limit sooner than later.
Darkaiser 18/09/17 23:38
I am under the impression that the current max speed is limited by the game engine and how fast it can process information. I would be pleased if we could increase it but it may not be possible.
Mumberthrax 19/09/17 00:23
If it were a limitation of the game engine then the existence of countless speed mods for the game would be impossible. Such mods exist, therefore it is not impossible for the speed to be increased in the base game. The question is to what extent would such changes affect the stability of an already unstable game? Such a question ought to be explored.
Darkaiser 19/09/17 04:37
Yes, the mods exist. Ever use one? How WELL do they work? I've heard comments regarding everything from phantom objects (collisions with things that were not there), phasing through objects that WERE there, to issues with weapons (missiles can't fly fast enough to hit the targets) etc. I think it's safe to assume that if raising the speed limit were easy, they would have done it by now. Also...please don't make broad sweeping statements about the playerbase without stats to back it up. You actually have NO idea how many players use or do not use speed mods. I, for one, do not and the reasons I listed are part of the reason why.
Mumberthrax 19/09/17 18:14
@Darkaiser Yes I use a speed mod that raises the cap to around 500. I haven't noticed any more issues using it than without. Not sure what you're on about regarding sweeping statements, but I recommend taking a chill pill.
Krienas 21/09/17 19:30
@Mumberthrax I believe Darkaiser was talking about OP's statement that nobody play without speed mods. And I agree that conclusions without statistics is bits and pixels wasted. For example I never play with speed mods and do not have friends who does unless it is some niche orbital stuff. So yeah, to know truth you need stats.
duncandisorder 01/10/17 01:10
Please help support my "Furniture and Greenhouse" idea. It really is a good idea, if I say so myself. Personally, I think the game has overlooked a vital part of ship building. We have no furniture, like beds and desks or no bathroom items, like sinks, toilets and showers. Anyway, there's more to my idea, I would appreciate any votes. Thank you. https://feedback.keenswh.com/idea/furniture-and-greenhouse59c67aa110fc8
CodingRays 18/10/17 22:19
As far as i know SE uses Havok as their physics engine which already has support for continuous physics simulation. So maybe some complicated solution using a bounding sphere with continuous physics as an early testing method and doing some really smart collision mesh caching would be able to make it happen. It sounds like an obvious solution to me so the folks at keen probably already tested it or deemed it too complicated to test. At any rate i completely agree that the speed limit has to go. It was not that bog of a deal before planets but with them it just got infinitely worse
admiralpeck 10/12/17 07:04
i bet they could get the performance issues fixed if they removed that goddamn tool smoke, it is the bane of my life, and i triple my performance level by disabling it in the config, and even on higher end systems, like a stock 2016 alien ware laptop that my friend uses, will have performance increases of around 50% when you load it down after disabling the construction/tool smoke.
admiralpeck 10/12/17 07:08
there is a reason i said "that i know of." i know there are lots of people who play without speed mods, but most of the ones i know who don't use speed mods also don't use any other mods, though i do know one person who runs about 200 mods, none of which is a speed mod (unless you count the one with the fast-charging mini hyperdrives)
admiralpeck 10/12/17 07:09
also, i have more physics issues when i run the game vanilla, to be honest, like that one time my drill ship that had one more drill than the block limit would allow bounced off the lake and then created a hurricane of trees.
xphoenixxx 11/12/17 02:29
I think many of the physics assumptions made when keen work on the game, is that the max speed is ~ 100 Ie moving parts, blocks colliding, debris, players moving, hitting voxels etc. Although this (IMO) is a bad habit which has its roots in the earlier coders mindsets, its a habit they are stuck in.. but they did throw us a bone in the form of environment settings where you can set a higher speed if you desire. Thus all the speed mods and skybox speed mods. The game engine itself seems to cope up to about 300-600m/s unless you crash into something. If your ship is set to invulnerable the game engine seems perfectly happy up to about 1000m/s if little to no debris is thrown on impact. Above that odd things happen when you hit stuff, or grids load while you try to turn. The server simply cannot keep up. The speed itself seems very sensitive to the number of nearby grids and voxels however - murdering in game performance which is why they stick to 100m/s All I can suggest here is a clever modder make a speed mod that /also/ abstracts impacts when they occur over 100m/s. Basically here is the work the game needs to do in over simplified terms during an impact to overcome the vrage/havok limitations: 1: when speed is detected in excess of 100ms flag the ship as indestructable. This avoids particles, and debris being created in excess of the 100ms game performance limitations if an impact occurs. (this is the main reason keen wont do a speed increase - they prefer havok doing the physics instead of manually) 2: when the ship is detected coming in contact with or phasing through a voxel, calculate a crude penetration depth based on weight and speed, move the ship to that depth, and reduce its speed to about 20m/s and remove indestructable flag. 3: set off a warhead equivilant explosion in the path of the front most direction vector of the ship, representing impact forces, and remove any voxel along its travel path backwards to open air/space, then allow the ship to come to rest as its 20ms speed allows. This also works fine if it just went like a hot knife through butter on an asteroid. You leave a tunnel, but your ship still gets its front splattered by the explosion. 4: the use of harder materials like heavy armor may result in random parts of the ship surviving the explosion.. as would be expected if a battleship fell from space and penetrated the ground. 5: bonus points - spawn a few random ore objects represnting the voxels you just removed in the mod around the impact/exit hole as the "splash" damage. But not too many. Similar calculations would need to be done in grid impacts. Especially if both grids are going over 100ms. You would have to disable normal impact physics (to stop the performance killing impact calculations) and simply perform crude "remove" blocks along the impact path of the faster object, off the slower object, and follow up with an explosion spawned in front of the faster travel vector once its speed is reset to 20ms. Grids could probably go the extra step of spawning small warhead explosions along the path of removed blocks to "roughen up" the hole. Lastly the slower object would need to have motion added to its direction of travel in the direction of impact, maybe even assymetrical motion if it hit off centre and throw it into a spin. The faster (now 20ms) object should probably get some random spin too. All this would need to be done without creating excess particles or floating objects to avoid performance killing issues from the higher speed. Which means all the "shock and awe" special effects would need to be done simply and manually.